Gisela Schertling’s initial interrogation

Secret State Police [Gestapo]
State Police Headquarters Munich

Fingerprint taken*): [blank]
Fingerprint not necessary *): [blank]
Personal data has – not – been determined *) [blank]
Date: [blank]
Name: [blank]
Office Ref: [blank]
Bureau: [blank]
*) Cross out whatever is not applicable.

(Bureau of the official carrying out the interrogation): IIB. Munich, February 18, 1943.

The following was summoned – was brought in [for questioning]: Gisela Schertling, and gave the following statement, after having been instructed to tell the truth:

I. Regarding her personal data

1a) Family name, including additional designations [Note 1] (for women, also maiden name, or if appropriate, name of previous husbands): Schertling.

1b) Given names: Gisela.

2a) Occupation. The following information shall be given: Whether owner, Master Craftsman, business manager or assistant, journeyman, apprentice, factory worker, office clerk, sales woman, etc.; for married women, the occupation of their husband; for minors who are not employed, the occupation of their parents; for civil servants and government employees, the exact address of their bureau; for university students, the address of the university and major; for those who have earned academic honors (M.Eng., Dr., PhD), when and where the title was obtained. Philology [university] student. [Note 2]

2b) Income. None.

2c) Unemployed? If so, since when. No.

3) Born on February 9, 1922 in Pössneck / Thuringia. Administrative region: [blank]. Upper district court of [blank]. State: Thuringia.

4) Residence or most recent domicile in Munich. Administrative region: [blank]. State: [blank]. Lindwurm Plaza Str. 13/3. Telephone number: [blank].

5) Citizenship: German Reich. Citizen of the Reich? Yes.

6a) Religion (including prior) Lutheran. 1) Member of a religious community or a philosophical society? If yes, which one. [blank] 2) Theist: Yes or No [blank]. 3) Agnostic: Yes or No [blank].

6b) Are the parents of German blood? Yes. Are the grandparents of German blood? Yes.

7a) Marriage status (single – married – widowed – divorced – separated): Single.

7b) First and last name of spouse (for women, include maiden name): [blank].

7c) Residence of spouse (if different residence): [blank].

7d) Are or were the parents – grandparents – of the spouse of German blood? [blank].

8) Children: Legitimate: a) Number: None. b) Ages: [blank]. – Illegitimate: a) Number: [blank]. b) Ages: [blank].

9a) First and last name of father: Paul Schertling, businessman, owner of a printing press in Pössneck. Occupation and residence: [blank].

9b) First and maiden name of mother: Lotte Sch., nee Pressler. Occupation and residence: In Pössneck.

(This information should be provided even if parents are deceased.)

10) First and last name, occupation, and residence of guardian or trustee: No.

11a) Passport was issued Saalfeld, on around 1936, No. [blank].

11b) Permission to drive a motor vehicle – motorcycle – was granted by the No on —-.

11c) Peddler’s license was issued by No.

11d) Identity card in accordance with § 44a of the commercial code was issued: No.

11e) Hunting license was issued by No.

11f) Master Mariner’s Certificate or Pilot’s License was issued on No.

11g) Subsidy certification (civil service subsidy certification) was issued by [blank]. Pension decision: [blank]. Social security offices?

11h) Other forms of identification? [blank] [Note 3].

12a) Has this person been chosen or selected as a juror [Note 3] for this or the next electoral period? [blank] By which panel (§ 40 GDG)? [blank].

12b) Mediator (commercial, labor) or committee member of a social disciplinary court? [blank].

12c) Guardian or trustee for anyone else? If so, whom? [blank]. Which Court of Chancery? [blank].

13) Membership in a division of the Reich Chamber of Culture (exact description)? No.

14) Membership

14a) In the NSDAP [Note 5] since: No. Last local [Party] organization: [blank].

14b) With which organizations? Member of BDM since 1943 [sic].

15) Reich Labor Service: Where and when reviewed? Überlingen / Lake Constance 1941. Results: Fit for service. Member of the Labor Service from April 1941 to September 1941, and six weeks of KHD in Sigmaringen.

16) Military experience

16a) Drafted or volunteered for which unit? [blank].

16b) Excluded [from military service] due to unworthiness [Note 6]? [blank]. When and why? [blank].

16c) Served from Did not serve. Unit: [blank]. Location: [blank]. Discharged as: [blank].

17) Decorations and medals (list individually): None.

18) Prior convictions? (Short statement by the accused. Insofar as possible, these statements shall be supplemented by a search of official documents.) No.

II. To the Case:

To her person:

I am the oldest of my [sic] three sisters. First I attended elementary school in Pössneck, and after that secondary school until final exams (Mittlere Reife). After that, I attended Dr. Weiss’s Women’s Secondary School in Weimar. After that, I went to the Spetzgart Secondary School for Home Economics near Überlingen on Lake Constance. There I took the Abitur on Easter 1941.

After that I was obligated to do my Reich Labor Service (RAD) duty and War Auxiliary Service (KHD). In November 1941, I was discharged to continue my studies. During the Winter Semester of 1941/49 [sic] I was at the University of Jena. In the Summer Semester 1942 I attended the University of Freiburg. I started at the University of Munich during the Winter Semester 1942/43.

I have never been politically active. I have belonged to BDM since 1934.

To the Case:

I met Sophie Scholl in RAD in 1941. That was at the camp in Krauchenwies near Sigmaringen. We have been close friends since that time.

Since I grew up in a National Socialist family and attended National Socialist schools, I already noticed Scholl’s negative attitude towards National Socialism while we were in Labor Service. This was noticeable in negative conversations about current ideology. After finishing my Labor Service, I continued our friendship only through correspondence until the beginning of the Winter Semester 1942/43 in Munich.

Since we have been in Munich, we have been together nearly daily. Therefore I also met her brother Hans Scholl, who is studying medicine. I was also with him very often, both in the presence of his sister and also alone. When we were together, we often talked about politics.

Both Scholls are very religious [Note 7] and frequently told me that our current theory of life needs renewal, and that Christian movements needed to be propagated. Scholl primarily stressed that another era must come in which there was more freedom in the fields of art and literature.

Both of them were primarily critical of the fact that the Führer allows the church so little freedom and that he does not permit the cultural movements that emanate from it [the church] to grow to maturity. They also often said that they believed that democracy must once again come [to Germany].

I argued these political matters vehemently with Scholl, because I was largely of the opposite point of view.

I am aware that this morning, leaflets were distributed in the university. When the lecture was over with, I saw a stack of white papers in front of the door to the lecture hall. However, I did not concern myself with the papers, because I had to go to the university office to pick up my [student] ID.

When I then got to the university entrance, I learned from the students gathered there that no one could leave the university. After about half an hour, we could leave the university again after showing our ID cards.

I then went to the Scholls’ apartment (Franz Joseph Str. 13/1) to go to lunch with them at Kaiser Friedrich Gasthaus on Hohenzollern Str. I met two Secret State Police agents in their apartment, and they took me into temporary custody. I immediately thought that Scholls must have been arrested. I suspected that they could have been involved in the distribution of leaflets. That is because I knew how they thought.

I was not with Scholls the last two evenings. I must correct that. Evening before last [February 16, 1943], Hans Scholl visited me. He stayed with me all night and slept on the couch that is in my room. Since it had gotten pretty late, he did not want to go home.

Since I have been in Munich, he has spent the night in my room about three times. This last time, he showed up around 11 pm. A week and a half ago, he showed up around the same time.

Whenever he would visit me, he would read aloud to me from my books, or we would talk about things and personal matters. With regards to my relationship with [Hans] Scholl, I would like to state that he only saw it as a love [i.e., sexual] relationship. We were only close as people.

Neither Scholl nor his sister ever mentioned anything to me about leaflets or treasonous activity. I never observed the least thing in that regards.

I only noticed that about 1-1/2 weeks ago, the two of them together with a friend named “Alex” worked a lot on a typewriter in a room (Scholl’s bedroom), allegedly in preparation for their medical exams. For that reason, I did not concern myself with it, but rather stayed in Sophie Scholl’s room.

I know that Scholl often met with Prof. Huber in Munich, Prof. Muth in Solln, and the bookstore owner named Söhngen in Munich. His friends [Note 8] in the Student Company were primarily “Alex” and “Willi”. I do not know their last names.

Scholl has no connection to my father. He does not know him at all.

I cannot make any additional statements. I have told the truth.

Recorded: Signed Grimm

Read and signed by: Signed Gisela Schertling.

Addendum: Gisela Schertling admitted: “I can recall that my friend Sophie Scholl repeatedly bought envelopes recently. She also asked me to buy envelopes for her, so she could write letters to her relatives. If I had known why she really wanted them, I never would have helped her.”

Signed: Schmauβ [Note 9], KS.


Note 1: E.g., Junior, II.

Note 2: Written stud.phil. Should be translated as philology [university] student because of subsequent documents.

Note 3: Surprising that this is blank, because we know she had her student ID card with her.

Note 4: The original document used two different words that mean the same thing (juror). The first is archaic (Schöffe), the second contemporary usage (Geschworener).

Note 5: National Socialist Party.

Note 6: Not the same as “unfit for duty” – not related to physical ability.

Note 7: Klerikal.

Note 8: Freunde. That is, close friends, not acquaintances.

Note 9: The addendum was not signed by Gisela Schertling.


Source: Schertling/Schüddekopf (5 – 10)

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